2020/21 Hot Stove: What Do You Propose?

[jeffmetsfan]

The thread only for proposing mock GM trades and shredding them to pieces. I'll kick it off...

Mets get: Blake Snell and Kevin Kiermaier
Rays get: Amed Rosario, Brandon Nimmo, David Peterson and Francisco Alvarez

Who says no?

[mjjm367]

I would suggest that you put your reasoning why this could be a reasonable trade along with the proposal. I'm assuming that you feel that this trade is possible, so explain why you think so.

Rays say no.

Rays get Rosario (2020 OPS .643) for SS - they already have Adames (2020 OPS .813 at SS)
Rays get Nimmo to play corner OF, give up multiple GG CF Kiermier (3 more years, $36M total). Who plays CF for the Rays now?
Rays give up stud pitcher Snell, on an affordable contract (3 more years, $40M total) for middle-to-back-of-rotation minimally proven Peterson.
Rays get Mets #2, MLB top 100 prospect, two way C Alvarez.

So Rays get a significant downgrade at P, a SS they don't need, and trade their starting CF for a corner OF. All to get an admittedly great prospect in Alvarez. And it's not like there is any cost savings here, Snell is a huge bargain contract.

The Rays most certainly could get a far better deal for Snell.

And the Mets?

Snell replaces Peterson, giving us a great top 3 in the rotation. Even without signing Bauer, this is a stud top 3. Cost savings is huge for 3 years, allowing the Mets to pick among the better non-Bauer options and still have money to dip heavily into the reliever pool, and/or extend Conforto. Or go for bauer and have the ultimate rotation.

Kiermier eliminates the need for Springer, freeing up even more money. At this point, Mets go after Realmuto, especially since you have traded away your catcher of the future, Alvarez. And they have the funds available now to win the bid.

So this trade is a great one for the Mets, and a poor one for the Rays.

You really need to support your proposals. Maybe you see this in a totally different way.

[NY FANG]

I agree - my guess is the Rays are looking for something closer to Peterson, Alvarez, Allen to get JUST Snell. Kiermaier will likely take another prospect haul (though likely not of the elite scale as Snell).

[Canadian Mets Fan]

I say yes to that deal in a heartbeat, but that's as a Mets fan.

MJJM, the Rays will likely turn to Manuel Margot to play CF if they trade Kiermaier. Margot has experience playing CF from his days with the Padres and is younger and cheaper than Kiermaier. That's the Rays MO.

[jeffmetsfan]

I'm sorry. Backing up the trade proposal is not part of the game. Obviously the Rays would want more. But how much more is the question. Perhaps adding Dom Smith gets it done. Is that something we would be okay with?

Next trade proposal:

Mets get: Francisco Lindor and Austin Hedges
indians get: Amed Rosario, Matthew Allan, and JD Davis

Who says no?

[mjjm367]

I'm sorry. Backing up the trade proposal is not part of the game.

Steven Matz for Mike Trout. Who says no?

[West Coast Mets Fan]

The Angels, they also want Nimmo to replace Trout. lol (I posted that just for you mjjm)

[mjjm367]

Then I say no. I know Trout is good, but be for real, you're talking about Nimmo!!!!

[mjjm367]

I say yes to that deal in a heartbeat, but that's as a Mets fan.

MJJM, the Rays will likely turn to Manuel Margot to play CF if they trade Kiermaier. Margot has experience playing CF from his days with the Padres and is younger and cheaper than Kiermaier. That's the Rays MO.

Forgot about him. You are right, that would be a typical Rays move.

[jeffmetsfan]

This is a franchise that chose to take Steven Souza Jr. over Trea Turner!

[Canadian Mets Fan]

Yeah, trading Turner was clearly a mistake, and a big one. The more I see of Turner the more I like him. Or should I say, the more I hate him as he continually kills us.

[NY FANG]

This is a franchise that chose to take Steven Souza Jr. over Trea Turner!

are the Mets suddenly flawless in their trades? This is the franchise that took Kazmir from us for Victor Zambrano!!

[NY FANG]

I'm sorry. Backing up the trade proposal is not part of the game. Obviously the Rays would want more. But how much more is the question. Perhaps adding Dom Smith gets it done. Is that something we would be okay with?

Next trade proposal:

Mets get: Francisco Lindor and Austin Hedges
indians get: Amed Rosario, Matthew Allan, and JD Davis

Who says no?

This one is at least more fair than the other as it's a 1 year rental and a offensively challenged catcher. I happen to think the Indians can get more than this (Rosario hasn't dazzled and JD Davis is FAR from proven that 2019 wasn't a fluke).

Personally, I say no for all the reasons that we have previously discussed for Lindor. With a surplus of SS FAs on the horizon, and a potential defensive wizard already on our team, there are other places I think we can put the 30-35MM that Lindor would cost. Further, we're going to need Matt Allen sooner than later to fill in our rotation.

[mjjm367]

I like the idea of this thread, but once again, I think whoever makes the original proposal ought to, at the least, give an idea why he thinks this may be a possibility. Otherwise, you are just throwing random names out there for reaction.

For example, my previous suggestion of Matz for Trout. If I had no need to explain at all, aren't I "playing the game" of the thread?

Let me repropose that trade - Matz AND Gsellman for Trout.

[West Coast Mets Fan]

I like the idea of this thread, but once again, I think whoever makes the original proposal ought to, at the least, give an idea why he thinks this may be a possibility. Otherwise, you are just throwing random names out there for reaction.

For example, my previous suggestion of Matz for Trout. If I had no need to explain at all, aren't I "playing the game" of the thread?

Let me repropose that trade - Matz AND Gsellman for Trout.

What? I thought it was Matz and Nimmo?

[NY FANG]

I don't agree that a reason is needed. The reason should be "this would help both the Mets and the other team out and is an equal valued trade" and that should go without saying. I would further say that none of us are experts in the field, so expecting anyone to truly know the needs (especially on a minor league level) of another team makes it hard to give a reason.

I'd be happy with this game if the trades feel fair and not a fantasy baseball trade where we say "take all our extra parts and give us a star"

Using Lindor as the example - he could embellish the proposal by saying the Indians are in a trade him or lose him situation, and Lindor would be a star for the Mets... but that's not telling us anything helpful about the proposal.
Or for Snell - TB is trying to dump salary and get back cheap, controllable future stars, but again, would that wouldn't be news to anyone here.

So I maintain a reason isn't needed, but trades should be within reason. (see what I did there 🤣)

[West Coast Mets Fan]

What is the reason for your reasoning on this topic?

[NY FANG]

to go against whatever MJJM says.

[mjjm367]

LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In the running for best post of 2020.

[mjjm367]

I don't agree that a reason is needed. The reason should be "this would help both the Mets and the other team out and is an equal valued trade" and that should go without saying. I would further say that none of us are experts in the field, so expecting anyone to truly know the needs (especially on a minor league level) of another team makes it hard to give a reason.

I didn't mean to imply that Jeff's trade suggestion was off the wall, or anything like that. I like this thread's concept, kudos to him for starting it.

I would still like to see his reasoning for his trade suggestions. He obviously put some thought into them, they are not off the wall suggestions. Jeff, why did you pick these guys, on both sides? Maybe you see something one of us doesn't, and it makes more sense that what we are thinking. Give you an example - in another thread, I was initially not in favor of Springer. Debate with other posters has changed my mind.